[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Hi folks! Im want to buy myself a good home rig that also can function as a portable one( closed back) and need some guidance since its a ton to choose from. Im happy to buy secondhand/used. Read much about planars reccently, but its not easy to get planars in my budget or being mobile. Im want overears and closed back cause of leakage both ways. I got an rha t20 IEM, idk but seems IEMs in general are a bit uncomfortable to me since i got a hearing damage, and IEMs is triggering it very often. So overear closed back is mainly what im looking for paired with a dac/amp that can be a littleportable some times( out walking).

Sound quality more important than bluetooth etc. So i am happy to run cables.

My budget is 600$, but can go a bit higher and offcourse lower=)!

Ive been looking at Audeze Sine, mobius and mostly closed back planars, but i am aldo open for other types.

Im mainly going to use Tidal. I have a samsung a5 phone with crappy sound, so im not sure to buy a used android DAP or use my phone +dac. What do u reccomend?

I like rock, metal ,mostly everything made by instruments.will aldo use it to watch some serieS. I dont listen to rap,hiphop,trance , hardstyle etc. Not very bassy music.

What do you guys reccomend?

 

[gimmeheadroom]

What kind of travel? Before the plague I was flying 12 times a year and for me bulky gear is out. I go with IEMs because I don't have to leave them on the seat when I go to the can but folding headphones like old PX 100s, Koss Porta Pros or something like that would probably be good. For buses and trains I also don't want fullsize headphones.

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

What kind of travel? Before the plague I was flying 12 times a year and for me bulky gear is out. I go with IEMs because I don't have to leave them on the seat when I go to the can but folding headphones like old PX 100s, Koss Porta Pros or something like that would probably be good. For buses and trains I also don't want fullsize headphones.

I am not gonna travel.Was thinking about a rig that is/can be portable. F.ex a closed planar headphone and a dac + my phone.

 

[bland125]

The idea is to find the balance between practical and good enough sound for portable. I have different options for my different scenarios and that works best for me.

Your phone, a DAC/amp dongle + portable HP are a good way but I have been there and I'm done with that.

I now use RHA T20 Wireless for portable with Spotify whenever I can't use my DAP and proper IEMs.

Do you stream or listen to your music files? Do you have a thing against Bluetooth HP?

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

The idea is to find the balance between practical and good enough sound for portable. I have different options for my different scenarios and that works best for me.

Your phone, a DAC/amp dongle + portable HP are a good way but I have been there and I'm done with that.

I now use RHA T20 Wireless for portable with Spotify whenever I can't use my DAP and proper IEMs.

Do you stream or listen to your music files? Do you have a thing against Bluetooth HP?

The idea is to find the balance between practical and good enough sound for portable. I have different options for my different scenarios and that works best for me.

Your phone, a DAC/amp dongle + portable HP are a good way but I have been there and I'm done with that.

I now use RHA T20 Wireless for portable with Spotify whenever I can't use my DAP and proper IEMs.

Do you stream or listen to your music files? Do you have a thing against Bluetooth HP?

The idea is to find the balance between practical and good enough sound for portable. I have different options for my different scenarios and that works best for me.

Your phone, a DAC/amp dongle + portable HP are a good way but I have been there and I'm done with that.

I now use RHA T20 Wireless for portable with Spotify whenever I can't use my DAP and proper IEMs.

Do you stream or listen to your music files? Do you have a thing against Bluetooth HP?

Ive updated my post so its more precise of what i want. Trying as good as i can=)
Bluetooth isnt something i need. Tried The xm3 but that was a let down. Momentum m3 was better! Clearer sound, better bass response and wider soundstage to me. I want as much as i can get for my budget. I can get an Audeze Sine in good condition with both cipher cable and 3,5 mm + earpads for overear conversion for 200$ used. The mobius is around 250$ used and 270 for demo version. Impossible for me to try due to where i live. And i aldo heard that Audeze may release LCD1 closed back, and that would prob be perfect to me, but i dont know if thats true.

 

[Goldvein]

Sounds to me like you're looking for the oppo pm-3. Portable planar. Their sound should be very good compared to their portability. I haven't tried them, since I went for the nightowl, and I would recommend them if they weren't too big for going around.

 

[Sonic Defender]

Better yet, and really worth considering is the Panda + from Drop. I expect that it will be a fantastic Bluetooth headphone based on the Oppo PM3 as Drop purchased the technological data so that they can produce all of the former Oppo line of headphones. I loved the PM3, but for some the dynamics were a little too restrained. Still, one could purchase the Panda and sell it if it didn't meet their expectations, but based on what I have been reading I expect that it will be quite well implemented and worthy of consideration. Good luck however you go and do update the thread with your decision. I found the Sine to be a little less comfortable than I cared for when I had it here for a few weeks.

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Better yet, and really worth considering is the Panda + from Drop. I expect that it will be a fantastic Bluetooth headphone based on the Oppo PM3 as Drop purchased the technological data so that they can produce all of the former Oppo line of headphones. I loved the PM3, but for some the dynamics were a little too restrained. Still, one could purchase the Panda and sell it if it didn't meet their expectations, but based on what I have been reading I expect that it will be quite well implemented and worthy of consideration. Good luck however you go and do update the thread with your decision. I found the Sine to be a little less comfortable than I cared for when I had it here for a few weeks.

Thanks man! Been reading alot of your posts=).. How did the Sine sound to you? Never tried them but people are mention the lack of comfortability with them, but the overearpad conversion will fix that issue afaik and heard.Ive been reading alot on the Drop x Panda. Very interesting indeed!its 399$, but with shipment to Norway + 25% VAT after that and atlast a 30$ handling fee, it will end up 550-600 in worst case.. Norway in a nutshell!

 

[Sonic Defender]

Thanks man! Been reading alot of your posts=).. How did the Sine sound to you? Never tried them but people are mention the lack of comfortability with them, but the overearpad conversion will fix that issue afaik and heard.Ive been reading alot on the Drop x Panda. Very interesting indeed!its 399$, but with shipment to Norway + 25% VAT after that and atlast a 30$ handling fee, it will end up 550-600 in worst case.. Norway in a nutshell!

I can only imagine that there are many wonderful things about living in Norway, but the taxation system while likely necessary to deliver social policy isn't the most fun. Canada is somewhat similar in that we have a pretty high tax burden, but also a decent amount of social service. Clearly Canada benefits from our proximity to the US so prices tend to be very similar. I wish I remembered more about the Sine, I do know that I liked it generally and felt that it had a dynamic sound. I think I found it slightly fatiguing, but with the comfort I didn't really get to use it nearly enough to have a solid opinion one way or the other. If I had to guess I suspect I would have enjoyed the sound, assuming the comfort wasn't a factor. I owned and very much enjoyed the LCD 2F but didn't compare them directly.

I also enjoy the KEF Space One wireless quite a bit and found that it sounded very good when used passively driven by my FiiO Q5s. I mention the KEF as despite being I think a very well done sound signature, it just never seemed to take off, it was quite expensive; however, because it failed to really take off many places have been clearing them out. I did not need another portable, but I had been curious about the Space One as I previously owned and enjoyed the KEF M500, so when it went on sale locally for $197 I just had to pick it up. I am very glad that I did so if you see it on Amazon or elsewhere with a return policy that you can live with just in case, that is also another option worth considering. I tend to gravitate toward dynamic headphones, but I don't mind a little restrained upper frequencies as long as they are balanced and prominent enough. I also like there to be a little warmth in the upper bass and midrange frequencies as that is where the music lives. With that in mind I like the KEF as it is quite dynamic while also having a nicely controlled but present bass presentation. Not at all bassy mind you, and I do tend to EQ the low bass upward, but only a by a few decibels.

What music do you listen to and what sound signature characteristics are most important to you? That information may help others provide you more targeted suggestions. Cheers.

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

I can only imagine that there are many wonderful things about living in Norway, but the taxation system while likely necessary to deliver social policy isn't the most fun. Canada is somewhat similar in that we have a pretty high tax burden, but also a decent amount of social service. Clearly Canada benefits from our proximity to the US so prices tend to be very similar. I wish I remembered more about the Sine, I do know that I liked it generally and felt that it had a dynamic sound. I think I found it slightly fatiguing, but with the comfort I didn't really get to use it nearly enough to have a solid opinion one way or the other. If I had to guess I suspect I would have enjoyed the sound, assuming the comfort wasn't a factor. I owned and very much enjoyed the LCD 2F but didn't compare them directly.

I also enjoy the KEF Space One wireless quite a bit and found that it sounded very good when used passively driven by my FiiO Q5s. I mention the KEF as despite being I think a very well done sound signature, it just never seemed to take off, it was quite expensive; however, because it failed to really take off many places have been clearing them out. I did not need another portable, but I had been curious about the Space One as I previously owned and enjoyed the KEF M500, so when it went on sale locally for $197 I just had to pick it up. I am very glad that I did so if you see it on Amazon or elsewhere with a return policy that you can live with just in case, that is also another option worth considering. I tend to gravitate toward dynamic headphones, but I don't mind a little restrained upper frequencies as long as they are balanced and prominent enough. I also like there to be a little warmth in the upper bass and midrange frequencies as that is where the music lives. With that in mind I like the KEF as it is quite dynamic while also having a nicely controlled but present bass presentation. Not at all bassy mind you, and I do tend to EQ the low bass upward, but only a by a few decibels.

What music do you listen to and what sound signature characteristics are most important to you? That information may help others provide you more targeted suggestions. Cheers.

Wierd that u mention Kef Space one! These just had a massive price drop now new, down to 150$ and there is 1 used in mint condition for 80$ plus shipping.what do u think? I can also get a xm3 for 100$ used(sounded a little muddy to me, but didnt try it with my own stuff,just in store). AKG nc700m2 for 60$,but these doesnt have ldac or aptx /aptxhd. B&O h6 for 50$. We r blessed with our social services though. Hospitals etc are free. After paying ca 230$ at our doctor,spesialist, medications(for reimbursable prescriptions) etc in total,everybody gets a free card that last through the year=). The only healthcare that we need to pay in full is dentists. We pay normaly max 36% tax. It will be easier for me when borders opens up again though. I live on the border to Sweden who are in EU(Norway r not) . If i use a store or local postoffice in sweden as Poste Restante,i dont have to pay vat when shopping in other EU countries.

Music i listen to is : Frank Zappa, nick cave, tom waits, tool, pantera, mr bungle,john frusciante, Einstürzende Neubauten, hendrix, hellacopters... mostly rock and experimental stuff and also classical music. Usually odd signature music, and guitarbased. Im a huge fan of zappa and i have wondered how those awesome albums will sound on good head gear. I think im more a flat guy than V shaped. In zappas music there is many instruments going on and i need to hear everyone.

 

[Sonic Defender]

So, I am making recommendations that are inline with true portable use, but also that will be quite adequate for more critical listening. I really do think the KEF is worth getting, certainly at that price. The build quality is fantastic and I think they are extremely comfortable. I am a fan of the XM3, but without equalizing the bass bloat down I completely agree, they are muddy sounding. Once equalizing the bass down the XM3 clean up nicely and are actually a very nice headphone. As for the fact that the KEF doesn't support LDAC etc, my personal experience is that it doesn't matter at all. AAC is the codec I connect my Space One with and there are quite a few technically based opinions out there that suggest that AAC is actually better technically than Apt X. Since getting the KEF, despite really enjoying the Sony XM3 I actually reach for the KEF almost all the time when I am on the go.

When I first received the KEF I used it with my Q5s wired and I was suitably impressed, and that was without any effort at equalization. I liked what I heard quite a bit. Certainly if you favour a little flatter response I think the KEF comes across as more balanced. I like when speaker companies put their experience into headphones and KEF for me have a great sound reproduction ethos, I gel with it. I think the music choices you like, many I listen to myself (I have had the pleasure of seeing Tool live for Lateralus and 10 000 Days) would fare very well with the KEF. If you do end up trying the KEF I would be very interested in your take, and I think it plays across genres very well. I listen to quite a bit of EDM and vocal jazz along with rock so I cover a fair range of musical styles. Some examples of artists material that I have used with the KEF: Tool, Diana Krall, Thievery Corporation, Dave Matthews Band, Rush, Steely Dan, Tears for Fears, Depeche Mode, Eagles, Black Eyed Peas, 9Bach, Peter Gabriel, Holly Cole ….

 

[bland125]

Thanks for clarifying your use case. It sure help us guiding you around. Bluetooth is somewhat of a compromise on SQ so if you can manage to carry a phone with a dac/amp or even better: a DAP, you should definitely go that route. Also considering what you said about taxes and import fees, that affect your budget that I think is good but gets diminished. You might end up having to get upgrades in multiple steps unless you can limit yourself to locally available equipment?

Start with heaphones for sure. Why the Audeze Sine or Mobius? They check portability yes but I am not so sure about SQ. Not that you will not like them but they are not the usual go to heaphones for SQ recommendation and not much else tbh. I always look at a freq resp graph before buying because over time, I have learned to understand them and do my own analysis of what I like and what I do not. Well produced graphs are not a be all and end all, they don't tell everything but they don't lie.

If you really want to try entry Audeze planars, go ahead but set your expectations accordingly.

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Thanks for clarifying your use case. It sure help us guiding you around. Bluetooth is somewhat of a compromise on SQ so if you can manage to carry a phone with a dac/amp or even better: a DAP, you should definitely go that route. Also considering what you said about taxes and import fees, that affect your budget that I think is good but gets diminished. You might end up having to get upgrades in multiple steps unless you can limit yourself to locally available equipment?

Start with heaphones for sure. Why the Audeze Sine or Mobius? They check portability yes but I am not so sure about SQ. Not that you will not like them but they are not the usual go to heaphones for SQ recommendation and not much else tbh. I always look at a freq resp graph before buying because over time, I have learned to understand them and do my own analysis of what I like and what I do not. Well produced graphs are not a be all and end all, they don't tell everything but they don't lie.

If you really want to try entry Audeze planars, go ahead but set your expectations accordingly.

Thanks for ur opinion=) Ive read alot reviews, articles about planar vs dynamic etc. The reason that i am a little "fixated" about Audeze's, is planar drivers. Very interested to try planars out due to what i've read about them. It seems to fit my taste well, but since its quite a struggle for me to try before buy (That would OC be the best to do) i dont really know how they sound. Do u know a good site that explains how the frequenzy response curves work thoroughly? I underatand some of it but far from enough.

Oppo PM-3 and Audeze Sine is what i have found out by reading to be good entry level planar's. The PM-3 is not easy find without paying almost retail price for it used. I can get a very good price on Sine i think( and a little plus that cipher cable has a dacamp that seems great!). And atlast, after reading Tyll's review/impressions about it at InnerFidelity and some other places , i started to think that this headset must be a very good deal for around 180-220$ used whit ciphercable? Especially compared to others in that pricerange on the used market? After reading many reviews about Sine, it seems that the major drawback about them is comfort, listeningfatigue and to get a good seal cause it is an ON EAR. But that can be easily solved when converting it to over ear. It would be very interessting to talk with someone who was done it except of the guy who can sell it to me=)

What 'phones do you recommend for a guy that is entering the hifi/audiophile world? Doesnt need ro be planar.

I dont know if i got this right, but the more expensiver headset's i get, more expensiver equipment is needed to drive/ pair them well?. Therefor the Sine seems good. It seems to fit me usage very well , but i dont know if it does in reality.

I will prob use a phone with good chipset( LG V's or G8 thinq, vivo xplay 6) as a main player since i need a phone anyway OR buying a reasonable price DAP that streams from Tidal OR buying a portable dac/amp to use with whatever phone. But need advice about this also and read myself more up f.ex lg g8 thinq vs lowprice android DAP, vs dac.

And i have concluded that closed back is a must cause of soundleakage out of the phones ( small apartment and kids/girlfriend).

Excuse me for almost writing a book in reply=) English is a second language for me.

Thanks

 

[Goldvein]

Did you consider the elegias? It's a very dynamic headphone and not very planar like, but its such a joy to listen to, and the prices are going down. It's a little big to wear outside every day, and not that portable but personally I just love the sound.
It's very sensitive so you can run it with any source.
A guy on another site is selling them for 400€.
Also the reviews are based on their 900$ price and the prices are way lower now.
It would be a good idea to audition them first, but I know you cant. The sound is not for everyone just like the planar sound, and you cant really know if you like it until you've spent 2 weeks with it.

 

[bland125]

At this point, I suggest you buy the Audeze Sine used with the Cypher cable. Your interest and curiosity will not be satisfied if you don't and it's totally normal. If you end up not liking them, you can sell them back with minimal loss. Experimentation is key in this hobby and being open minded (within the limits of your requirements) will yield better results as you try more and more stuff.

For freq graphs, it takes time and effort to be able to properly understand them in relation to what you like. You can read on the Harman target response curve research to begin with and then always try to correlate your speakers, headphones and IEMs graphs with your own findings. Note that all 3 have different freq response behavior to begin with but IEMs. If something I'm interested in does not match my freq response likings, I will try them out before buying. I try to test everything before buying and like you, it's not always possible.

As for other recommendations, from a closed back perspective, I have been out of the game for too long. Meze 99 classics seem to have the favor of most. I now use open back headphones or IEMs when I need isolation from my wife and kids